Galadriel and Sauron balancing

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Donar
Posts: 1

Galadriel and Sauron balancing

Post by Donar » Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:20 am

I have always seen Ring heroes as way more powerful than any other character. I feel it should stay this way. It sticks to the core of the original game and most importantly, it firs the LORE.

If they are faction only heroes they will have to be balanced accordingly, though. Either they lose their power level or they put the game out of balance, I fear.

I may have some suggestion that could resolve it:

Make Galadriel and Sauron more powerful than other summonable entities such as Balrogs but include some risk to it.
What if you had to end the game, otherwise you would be put into a huge disadvantage. Summoning these two would suddenly have the "now or never" feeling to it.

What if Galadriel and Sauron...
... were summonable only once, then the spell would either be inaccessible for the rest of the game or the player would have to put 25 more spell point into it to use it again. (or any other number of points)
... applied buff to enemies when they are killed. (money income, permanent bonus to a maximum unit cap, a fog of war reveal, unlocking of a whole spellbook + resetting all cooldowns on it, shorter recruitment time in the barracks, unit damage...)
... applied opposite debuffs to the summoning player.

or

... were only summonable near your base and had to walk to the enemy (which would drain their time they have before they disappear + it would make them better on defence yet still very powerful on offence, just for a shorter period)
... did a lot of damage to units but needed help from regular units when taking down structures.
... were in more mobile and vulnerable "regular form" when summoned and could enter the "god mode" state when the battle comes (maybe their ability?). This god mode would not be accessible right away and gave the enemy a window in which he could deal with either Galadriel and Sauron before they get out of hand. The ability would unlock either after some time (it would be on cooldown upon the summoning) or after the ring hero scores X amount of kills.

I hope my ideas help to make this game as good as possible. Thank you for your work <3

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WerewolfMoonHunter
Posts: 112
Location: Poland

Re: Galadriel and Sauron balancing

Post by WerewolfMoonHunter » Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:09 am

I disagree with idea of creators. Summoning Galadriel and Sauron by Spellbook would... destroy all this great Ring Hunting mechanic, and also put fractions like Isengard, Goblins, Gondor and Dwarfs in the worst posision then Elves and Mordor. I think, about two, in my opinion better, ideas for solving this problems.

1. Leaving all Ring Hero idea as it was in BFMEII- I mean here that you must find the Ring, bring it to the fortress and recruit Galadriel or Sauron as Ring Heros. Maybe not perfect but simple.

2. Mixing ideas from BFMEII and Edain Mod- I mean here that every fraction should have it's own Ring Hero:

- Men of the West: Boromir or Gandalf
- Elves: Galadriel
- Dwarfs: Thorin or Dain
- Isengard: Sarumna
- Mordor: Sauron
- Goblins: Azog or Smaug

In this option you will be able to recruit Galadriel or Sauron (as for example: Necromancer) as regular heros and changing them into Ring Heros after bringing Rings to them. In my opinion, it will be more fair becouse every fraction will have it's own Ring Hero, you will not have to waist place in Spell Book, and both Galadriel and Sauron will have more "place" in regular game as more regular hero.

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Lostir
Posts: 204

Re: Galadriel and Sauron balancing

Post by Lostir » Fri Jun 26, 2020 9:58 am

I'm really no fan of making the ring heroes spellbook only, because it removes one of the best things of BfME2. Even if they were not a thing for competitive MP, they were great in SP or fun MP games.

Therefore, I completly agree with WerewolfMoonHunter.

1. were summonable only once, then the spell would either be inaccessible for the rest of the game or the player would have to put 25 more spell point into it to use it again. (or any other number of points)
2. applied buff to enemies when they are killed. (money income, permanent bonus to a maximum unit cap, a fog of war reveal, unlocking of a whole spellbook + resetting all cooldowns on it, shorter recruitment time in the barracks, unit damage...)
3. applied opposite debuffs to the summoning player.
1. would create a situation where the first player to gets them would likely win the game due to their power level and would either make them too expensive to see them at all, or far too strong
2. possible, but wouldn't work that well for a temporary spell, because you can always time it in a way that they won't be able to die in time rendering the downside invalid
3. could work, but might feel weird. And could create an unhealthy situation if you can circumvent the downside. For example, if they give a massive debuff to allies, you will just send them into the enemy solo, wrack havock and after they die use your own army to kill the leftovers

4. were only summonable near your base and had to walk to the enemy (which would drain their time they have before they disappear + it would make them better on defence yet still very powerful on offence, just for a shorter period)
5. did a lot of damage to units but needed help from regular units when taking down structures.
6. were in more mobile and vulnerable "regular form" when summoned and could enter the "god mode" state when the battle comes (maybe their ability?). This god mode would not be accessible right away and gave the enemy a window in which he could deal with either Galadriel and Sauron before they get out of hand. The ability would unlock either after some time (it would be on cooldown upon the summoning) or after the ring hero scores X amount of kills.
4. That could feel really bad, in particular depending on the map size. Or would make destroying the enemy base impossible due to a far too strong ring hero appearing there.
5. Basically an Army of the Dead style of spell? Could work. Probably the best way to go. Give them a distinct strength.
6. Might be too complicated. And the timer had to be clearly visible for the enemy.


If ringheroes should really be only via the spellbook, I would personally prefer something different, but probably rather close to 6. Make Sauron and Galadriel normal recruitable heroes (both are far too important to not be normal heroes in my opinion), which transform into their ring hero form, with a spellbook spell. And while they aren't not on the battlefield, the spell has a small passive effect instead.

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